W. L. POONJA
you are vigilant, watchful, there is no mind.
Simply keep watchful."
APAJI : It's
important to speak about 'notion', because whatever
is created and whatever is seen is just a notion.
Don't be surprised.
example, you may have a very tiny seed in the palm
of your hand; it may be a mustard seed, a banyan
seed or a sesame seed. You take a banyan seed in
the palm of your hand and what do you see in it? A
huge tree? A grand trunk, branches, flowers,
millions of fruit? And again billions and trillions
of seeds in it? In a tiny seed, no?
So, I'm comparing this with notion. This seed, when
it comes into contact with the soil, it sprouts and
becomes a tree. Likewise, a notion will sprout when
it touches consciousness. The notion has now
sprouted like this universe, time, space
all that you see past, present,
future, man, animals, mountains, rivers, forests.
It's a tiny seed-like notion. When consciousness
touches this notion, it sprouts and gives rise to
the mind. So all this becomes a notion: all these
diverse objects which appear spring from the single
notion that, "I suffer", "I am happy", "I am
bound", "I want to be free". All these are just
A sage is free from any notion because he knows
that all this is just a notion. But others, who
have yet to be enlightened, are not free from
notions. Therefore, they think that they are bound,
that they are suffering and that they have to get
enlightened, somehow, later on.
So, how to be free from all notions? Notion is just
a thought, your own thought. Now, this thought must
rise from somewhere. As a seed touches the soil,
sprouts, and becomes a tree, likewise, a notion
touches consciousness, sprouts and becomes a
Without soil, a tree could not sprout. In the same
manner, without consciousness as a substratum, mind
could not arise. Where could the mind stand unless
it has some soil, some foundation, some substratum?
So, those who know the substratum and the rise of
the mind, will never suffer. And those who will
begin from the sprout, from the notion itself, and
look at the branches, the fruit, the flowers and
the sufferings, the happiness and the joys of life,
they will endlessly suffer because they do not know
the substratum of all this. Thought is the
substratum. Thought is the mind. Mind is time,
space, past. How does it rise? It rises... or
rather it appears to rise although it is not true.
If it rises or not, if it is created or not... both
are simultaneously seen, as you see a mirage in the
desert. You see a running river in the desert, in
the sands. River is running. It can be said it
exists, and it also can be said to not exist. Both
are true. It looks like a river and people go
running to have a swim in it, because it looks like
a real river. And it is also true that it doesn't
exist because it is just sand. There's no river at
all, so both are simultaneous true.
So call this
'samsara', call this 'world'. It exists like a
mirage. And we can also say that it doesn't exist.
These truths are simultaneously real. If you take
it this way, then it is also true to say that "all
this is not real". "It is real" is also true, like
the mirage and like the seed. It is real because it
sprouted from consciousness. But as a notion it is
Ego arises from a notion ego of observer,
observation and observed. Here the trouble starts,
you see. But for the sage this trouble is not
there. His observer, observation and observed are
the same. Therefore he is happy. And the one who is
not happy, who has yet to be awakened, he thinks,
"I am the observer and this object of observation
gives me happiness which I experience." He is
surely in trouble. He has to get rid of his own
notions, somehow, either by sitting with a saint or
through investigating with his own discrimination,
So now there appear to be two things, you see. How
to get rid of this ego that brings us diversity? In
one, there is no diversity, yet in the other,
diversity and unity appear the same, like that of
the river in the desert appears real but is also
not real. The basis, the substratum of all these
diversities, dualities, are like the waves in the
ocean being none different from their substance,
water. So let there be multiplicity of waves which
cannot lose their oneness from the water. Even if
diversity appears people may look different,
have different views, have different shapes,
different forms but the essence is one. And
that essence is the same in all beings and
If you are aware of this then you are free, happy
and eternally blissful, because bliss comes when
you are ever aware of consciousness. There is no
difference between bliss and consciousness.
Diversity implies suffering, but if you know that
the origin of all diversity is consciousness, even
then you won't have any problem. You must arrive,
you must reach that underlying ground, you must
understand that the underlying essence of
everything is consciousness.
When you look at people, when you look at
mountains, when you look at a river, when you look
at your body, you must be conscious. You are
conscious. In the waking state you are conscious of
all the objects and you are conscious of your
activities with them. When you dream you are also
conscious of subtle activities and your subtle
relationships in the dream. You are quite aware of
the subject with all the objects, and you
experience the dual sense of objectivity and
subjectivity. You are conscious of all this. So the
basis of all this activity is consciousness. Even
in deep sleep you are also conscious, because you
say, "I slept" or "I had a very peace... sound
sleep." You are conscious. So, all these three
states are projected from consciousness. All these
things are afloat within consciousness, and you are
that consciousness. Even in transcending these
three states in the fourth transcendental
state you are still That.
And beyond the fourth state, beyond the turiya
state, no one knows. It is not known to anyone
because it is the very depth of consciousness, you
see. Even the word 'consciousness' is not found
there. No words, no experiences, no 'I', 'you',
'he' or 'she' ever exists there. This is your true
nature. This is the Truth. This is the ultimate
understanding. And this is always eternally present
here and now. It is presence itself. It is presence
itself. It is never absent at any time, and That
which is never absent is called Truth, Freedom,
Wisdom. Whatever is true must always exist here,
now and everywhere, and must be omniscient and
omnipresent. Omniscience and omnipresence is That
which you are. Now you have to playfully live along
with and enjoy all these waves with different
forms. This is your happiness.
Question: When I am in meditation, when I am
quiet, there is nobody else. I'm alone and at
Papaji: Yes, you are alone here. OK.
Question: But when I see everybody here, I
get confused. Is it all just consciousness?
Papaji: What is the confusion? How is your
aloneness disturbed? At the moment you are quiet,
at that time do you feel that you are living with a
body or not?
Question: There is no body, only
consciousness and I'm not suffering.
Papaji: Only consciousness. OK. Now, what is
it that arises from within consciousness and
disturbs you? First you went from outside into
consciousness because you were unhappy. You were
suffering, you were not quiet and wanted to keep
Question: Yes, that's true.
Papaji: You were not quiet, you didn't like
quietness, and somehow you entered into quietness.
So suffering ended when you entered quietness,
peace. Now, how did you disturb this peace? Now you
Question: I began to think.
Papaji: OK, you think within the peace.
Let's say you are in the middle of an ocean and
your head is pressed under water. What do you think
about in the water?
Question: I want to be free.
Papaji: Free from what?
like to get out.
Papaji: When you get out, what happens? You
are in the ocean, in the middle of the ocean. In
the same way, you say you are in the peace. And
this peace has no limitations. Peace has no
limitation, no demarcations, no North, South, East
and West. Now you want to be disturbed. How can you
disturb yourself? You have to jump out of peace to
be disturbed. Take a single step out of peace and
tell me that "I am disturbed now." Go out of peace,
somehow push peace away and then tell me, "Now I'm
not at peace." Who will not like peace? And if you
are out of peace, then what else have you given
preference to which is better than peace, more
beautiful than peace?
know I must go for peace.
Papaji: Yes, then how could you reject it?
And for what?
Question: I think it's an old habit that I
make all the time. I reject it and I...
Papaji: No, no. You have to decide one
thing, "I don't want peace". That's all, you decide
Question: No, I want peace.
Papaji: OK. If you want peace, you are in
peace. If you don't want peace, you are never in
peace. "I am not in peace" is just a notion. You
can never be in peace if you think like this.
That's all. There are only two things, you see. You
must decide what you want. This is your decision.
It is only your notion. Only a few people have
understood that "I am not peace" is just a notion,
not a good notion. Therefore you are here. So, what
do you decide here?
Question: Yes, I can feel it. Sometimes I
have this notion and then sometimes I like to go to
Papaji: Even then there's no problem. You
say, "Sometimes I am in peace and sometimes I am
not in peace." There's no problem even then.
This samsara is in front of you and you want to
make a permanent abode in it. This is the problem
that is troublesome. That's what you want. That can
never happen, you see.
For example, you are waiting for your connecting
flight in transit lounge of an airport. The transit
lounge is very comfortable. And they announce that
your flight is ready for boarding, and you say,
"No, no, I want to remain here. It's much better
here." What will happen? Can you stay there?
Papaji: No, you will never be allowed to
stay there. Now, this samsara is a transit lounge.
Everyone is waiting for his flight. There are many
announcements being made and everyone is waiting.
If you make friends with other people in the lounge
who have all got different flights, then it is only
going to make you sad at the time when one of you
has to fly away. You will suffer. Your flight
number will come and you will fly away. The lounge
will always be full of different people. So this
world is a transit lounge. Nobody has ever stayed
here permanently. Different faces appear all the
time. So, this samsara can never be peaceful
because everything is constantly changing.
Question: So, peace is somewhere else?
Papaji: Peace is always everywhere. But you
mistake it. When you attribute this peace to a very
particular place, you will be troubled. This
particularity troubles you. Peace is everywhere,
beauty is everywhere, love is everywhere,
consciousness is everywhere. Go wherever you want
to go. First of all, why did you put a demarcation
between peace and suffering? What makes you suffer?
Why are you looking for peace at all?
Question: I can feel it's the only way. I
must win peace. I need peace.
Papaji: I say, "You are peace!" Simply, if
you know this then you know the Truth. Then you can
do whatever you feel. That's all. You are
consciousness. You are everything and
In the deep sleep state there are no forms, no
names, no subjects and no objects whatsoever. You
don't see any mountains, any men, animals or birds.
You don't even see your own body. There is no
trouble within the sleep state. Why don't you bring
the sleep state into the next waking state? In the
sleep state you are very happy. Now you are slowly
entering into the next waking state, call it 6 a.m.
Now, at what time do you reject this happy state of
sleep? At what time and why?
Question: 6 a.m. and 1 second, when the
thoughts come in.
Papaji: Yes. So this thought was a notion
which was already there, previous to the sleeping
state. Before sleeping you say "I have to get up at
6 a.m.". So this notion, which was buried latently
into your unconscious mind, wakes you up. If the
last thought of the last waking state is "I am
free, I am happy", I am bliss and I am
consciousness", then the first thought of the next
waking state will also be "I am consciousness". In
the next waking state, who will wake up? Tell
Papaji: Consciousness. You slept within
consciousness and you are going to wake up within
consciousness. Now, in the sleep state try not to
descend, but rather try to ascend. From the sleep
state your intention must be to ascend because you
are always happy in sleep state, no? You say, "I
slept happily." So your next sleep state must
transport you to a higher state, not a lower state.
And that is called the fourth state.
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Who is there to realise that in deep sleep?
Papaji: The one who will not wake up in the
next waking state and who goes to the fourth
Question: This is also a notion then?
Question: When I first heard your teachings
about freedom I knew in my heart that these
teachings were Truth itself and that my going from
teacher to teacher was finished. Will you remove
the veil of my mind so that I know, beyond
intellectual understanding, who I really am?
Papaji: So until now, it has only been an
intellectual understanding, from teacher to
teacher. Now you ask, "Who am I really ?" Intellect
is always very deceptive when you try to understand
something. To know your Self you do not need any
intellect, you do not need anything. To know your
Self there is nothing to understand. You have not
to practice anything because freedom is already
here, the Self is already here and now. Freedom, if
not here, then where could it be possible? If not
now, then when? Freedom is stronger than the mind.
It is here and now. If you cannot attain it now and
here, then when and where will you attain it?
So your question is, "I really want to know who I
am." Isn't it? This question pertains to that Truth
itself. "Who am I?" pertains to that Truth,
Reality, light, wisdom, beauty, peace, which is
here and now. You have not to practice anything or
join any institute to learn it. You just have to
get rid of the notion that "I am not Reality".
That's all. You are Reality, but you have been
denying your true nature for ages. Taking yourself
to be the body, mind, intellect and senses has
concealed your true nature. The Truth remained
concealed and there sprouted ego.
When you say "I am", to you it means, "I am the
body", "I am the mind", "I am the intellect", "I am
the senses". So, somehow you have to do away with
these false notions. That which remains is the
Truth and can never be lost. It is always present
with you, always. That you are.
In this instant, you realise the Self by not
thinking and by not making any kind of effort.
Devote this instant to your Self, to be free
whenever possible. During this life span, at least
devote one single instant to your own Self, to be
free. Here, now, today. Keep quiet. Don't think. No
time, no effort. Do you follow?
Question: I follow.
Papaji: If you have, then tell what you are
Question: I'm totally happy.
Papaji: Keep quiet. Don't think and just
turn your face towards your own Self. Don't make
any effort, and in this finger snap, in this blink
of an eye, in this no-time instant, tell me what
you feel? Tell me, who you are and where you
Papaji: Here your question is answered. You
have finished your work, you have finished your
Question: Thank you.
Papaji: This is not a teaching because I
give you nothing to do. You only have to look
within your own Self, which is not absent, which is
never absent. It was only concealed by your desire
for something that was not eternal. That's all.
Eternity is here, peace is here. You have been
hankering after things that have deceived you for
millions of years. Notions! So,
now is the time, don't hesitate. If there is still
any trouble and you want some help, come forward,
don't run away, please ask.
Question: It feels like my mind wants to
think but it just can't. It feels like my mind
wants to come in and do something.
Papaji: You are vigilant, watchful. You are
watching. The mind is now coming in because for a
million years you have been letting it just enter
without asking you. Now you are looking at the
'thief'. Just watch this 'intruder', the
Question: When I look at it, then it
Papaji: Yes, yes, that's all. When you look
at it, it vanishes. You have never looked before,
at any time in your life. So this is how to take
care of the mind: when you look at it, it
Question: Why does it disappear?
Papaji: Because it is nothing. When you
don't look at it, when you are not watching, then
only it becomes a mind. When you don't look at this
process it becomes a mind, and when you are
vigilant, watchful, there is no mind. For this
reason I say, "Simply keep watchful."
Invite the mind; "Come in, you are allowed!", and
it will not come because there is no mind. The same
mind has now disappeared into the source.
Watchfulness, vigilance, is the source. When you
are not watchful, the samsara appears before you.
When you are not watchful, the mischievous mind
appears. But when you are watchful, there is no
mind. No mind is consciousness.
That's the simplest way to be happy. When you are
watchful, there is no mind. Simply keep quiet,
don't make any effort and don't think. 'Thinking'
means mind and 'mind' means past. Mind is always
from the past. In the present, you have no
relationship with mind. In the present, there are
no friends to make. Between 'no thinking' and 'no
effort' you have not made any friends, isn't it?
And all the old friendships you have had in the
past have gone now. 'Old friendships' means
suffering. Everybody has suffered with old friends,
You must befriend someone who remains with you at
all times and who will never divorce you. Loving.
Eternally loving. That's a very wise friendship,
isn't it? Don't be friends with anything that
changes. If you want to make a true friend, go
towards someone who will not run away from you.
There is only one friend that is not going to run
from you. Find out who it is.
Question: I see now that I have been
attempting to deal with suffering in some way; to
escape it, to heal it, to lessen it, to do
something about it. And suffering is not the
problem. The sufferer is the problem.
Papaji: Yes, yes. You can't avoid this
suffering, unless you know your Self. Your Self
doesn't suffer at all. Self is fearless. Fear
belongs to past. Fear is always from the past. Fear
is only in the mind and the mind is past. 'I' is
past. Find out who is here now? In this very
instant you have no fear. In the night, when you
say, "Now I will sleep", you enter the present
moment. You do away with the past moments of the
day. At that instant you don't have fear. You
remove the fear from the waking day. Nobody can
sleep when there is fear in the mind. Fear and
sleep don't go together. When you say, "OK, it is
now 11 p.m., goodnight." This 'goodnight' is
If you want to be fearless, know your Self now.
What is present right now? That you have to see
forever. When you say, "I am free of time, free of
of thought", that is presence. "I am free" is
presence and all the rest is past, including the
body. Whatever gets old must be from the past.
Question: Please Master, can you help me to
abide always in this stillness?
Papaji: Very good question. It can only be
done if the mind is kept empty. If a thought enters
the mind, it disturbs the emptiness. Remove the
mind, that's all. Then the inside emptiness will
never be disturbed.
Papaji: And outside, this is emptiness too.
It is all just nothing, nothing... So, this is also
all emptiness. You gain nothing.
Inner emptiness and outer emptiness are the same,
but the mind creates a difference. The mind says
that this inner emptiness is better than the outer
emptiness. It is like saying that the air inside
this room is better than the air outside. The
trouble comes with name and form. Mind is only name
and form. So, when the concept of name and form
goes, then everything is seen as one emptiness. Any
object, any activity in the world is this
emptiness. Then, there'll be no problem.
Now find out what
this name and form is.
Question: The ego.
Papaji: This ego is just name and form.
Saying that "I am so and so" creates a division.
When you say that "I am not at peace in the
activity of daily life", this is due to ego. So,
the concept "I am so and so" has to be removed.
Then all this will be seen as undivided, full
Consciousness is here. You need not work to attain
it. Now, we are here in this hall, and when we
leave, it will be empty again, just as it was
before we all entered. At this moment, emptiness is
full of boys and girls, isn't it? But this
emptiness is not complaining and saying "Please go
out, I am suffocating." Emptiness doesn't complain
and is unconcerned whether you go away or stay.
Emptiness is emptiness. Consciousness is
consciousness. The trouble is with you saying "I am
so and so". Simply remove this "I am so and so",
and move freely within consciousness. Then,
everybody will salute you wherever you go. Whatever
work is done will be beautiful work, because you
are not the doer. So long as doership is there, the
trouble arises. "I am not the doer", then
consciousness doesn't create any difference.
Whether you are working or meditating, no
difference. So, somehow doership has to vanish from
Consciousness cannot be tainted. And this is all
your projection, this samsara, the whole routine of
work is your projection: "I am doing". You are
always still, you have never
done any work. You get the work done by your body,
by your limbs. Move...
movement of your hands, feet, eyes, whatever it is.
These are moved and you
call it activity. My hand is holding the glass.
Movement, hand is moving.
Who is giving energy to the hand to hold the glass?
Go back now and tell me. Go to the reservoir of
energy that sends a message to the hand, "Pick up
the glass, do this work, do that work." When you
look at it, it will not complain. It is absolutely
immaculate and no doership. It gets work done
through everybody. It commands the sun to rise and
shine, and the oceans and winds to move. But it is
without any work, so serene, so peaceful. So That,
you must identify yourself with. You are that
peacefulness, you see, not the activity. You must
identify yourself with that energy, the source, the
basis, the ground or the soil of the energy that
works through the limbs, through all the bodies. It
is only the bodies that perform activities. The
source, the energy does nothing.
Wherever there is consciousness there
must be this energy to manifest this samsara
without losing its own peace. And you are That. If
you know this, if you understand this, then you are
always at peace and you will never complain. There
is no difference between 'this' and 'that'. There
is no differentiation at all.
You have done nothing. It is not 'your' activity.
Something made everything active. But you identify
yourself with the body and say, "I am active now".
So that "I am" must look towards it's source, from
where this energy is coming. Looking towards the
source destroys the "I am the doer" notion. Then
ego will no longer trouble you. This is what is
Question: What is the Self?
Papaji: When you ask, "What is this?", I
must show you an object and then you are satisfied.
But when you ask, "What is the Self?", it is not an
object of sight that could be presented to you. It
is something which cannot be seen, cannot be smelt,
cannot be touched, cannot be heard, cannot be
tasted and cannot be imagined by the mind. Now you
tell me what is left?
Earth can be seen, water can be seen, fire can be
seen and you can feel the movement of air. That
which is left is called akash, or emptiness. Can
you see emptiness? In what do all these four
elements appear? In akash, in emptiness. You are
there and I am here, and there is something in
between us. Call it 'space' or 'emptiness'. Can you
see it? That which surrounds you and through which
you can see is called 'emptiness', is called
'Self'. This glass can be seen only because it is
surrounded by something which cannot be seen. So,
anything that can be seen must be within something
which cannot be seen. That is God.
The question, "What is the Self?" arises from That.
Now, before the question arose, what was there?
Everything arises from something which is not
known, which is empty. Anything that comes, comes
from emptiness. Turn towards this emptiness and go
on dissolving within it. Don't touch any of the
four elements and tell me what is there?
Question: I see nothing.
Papaji: In this nothingness, is there
someone who says, "I see nothing"? You have to find
out who is witnessing nothingness. This is very
important. Go deeper and see who is the witness of
nothingness. There is water in the river and the
water is asking the river, "Who are you?". Like
this, you ask nothingness, "Who are you?".
Question: The water is part of the
Papaji: Yes, therefore give up the name.
Names belong to objects. Don't utter the name and
you will see that the answer to your question will
come to you. 'Water' and 'river' are only names.
Self has no name and no form. When you don't use
name and form, what do you see? Don't seek the name
and form of the Self, and then tell me what it
Question: It feels very large and is beyond
Papaji: It is beyond all words, beyond all
imagination and beyond all forms. It is very easy
to fall into formlessness. To go to the Himalaya
from here you have to travel 500 miles. The
Himalaya has a name and form and to see the
Himalaya you have to make some effort. But when I
tell you to see something which has no name and
form, why should this be difficult? You are not to
think and not to make any effort in order to find
the answer. Thinking is strenuous, so don't think.
You have not to go anywhere, so no effort is
required. No effort, no thinking, no name and no
form. What could be easier than this?
The eyes can see many things, but an eye cannot see
itself. Why not? I can see you but I cannot see my
own eye. Why not? Because it is very close to me
and so it need not be seen. That which is very
close to you cannot be seen. That which is very
near to you, you need not make any effort, nor
travel a certain distance to reach it. And it
doesn't take any time because it is already here.
So you need not move anywhere nor see anything. So
what is That? It is beyond imagination, so so don't
even make any effort to think. You will find it
when you don't think. The answer will come by
itself. Peace is already here.
Everybody lives in the past and that is why they
are in trouble. There is no time within the Self
and that is why it is peaceful. Nothing to do,
nowhere to go. Everything else is just your
imagination, like a mirage. You go into a hot
desert and you see a river flowing in the distance.
You run towards it to because you are thirsty and
need to cool down. When will you arrive to the
river? The water in the mirage is just imagined,
yet everybody is running towards this river to
quench their thirst. And what is this river? "I
want to enjoy this and I want to enjoy that." Name
and form itself is a mirage. If you touch any name
and any form, it is going to bite you because it is
not eternal. It is not eternal. Wherever there is a
name and a form, there is going to be trouble.
Every night when you go to sleep, you reject all
names and forms and you are in peace. Names and
forms are a mirage and you cannot be happy with
them. So when you do not touch name and form, you
are peace itself. It is only your imagination that
makes you think that there is something worthy to
be attained. You imagine that you have to do do
something, that you have to become wise and
enlightened within this life span. Take this
thought and place it in your heart. Then you will
see that peace, that freedom within your heart.
When you don't hold anything in your mind, you are
free. Like when you sleep, you have nothing in the
mind. When you sleep, everything returns to the
heart and you are happy. Everything returns to the
heart and then vanishes. All intentions disappear.
When you look into your heart you will see that you
are the Self and nothing else. Falling in love with
the Self is very wonderful. Having known the Self,
you have known everything.
The past is stronger than the present in the mind
because you cannot see the present. Everybody
speaks to you of the past. Do you find anyone among
your friends and relations who is speaking of the
present? Everyone speaks to you of the past;
therefore it has become very strong. You will have
to seek out the company of those who speak to you
of the present moment, then this will also become
much stronger and you will shun the company of the
past. To get rid of the past, keep company with
those who are trying to live in, or who have tasted
this moment of present, who are speaking about this
present life. Satsang means association with those
who live in Truth. Here everyone is speaking
everyday of this present moment, of peace and love
You have to be very strong and tight fisted with
your decision not to be lead away by those friends
who trouble you. Shun their company, even if they
are related to you. Nobody can trouble you if you
decide to be free. You have to make a firm decision
then nothing can trouble you. If you are weak,
everybody will trouble you. But if you simply keep
quiet I don't think any thought can come. Simply
decide to sit quiet. Then nothing can touch you.
Until now it is only that your decision has been
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